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Post by Celtic17 on Oct 16, 2005 19:50:37 GMT -5
Going small, like that, could put some teams on their heels. Could be nice at times.
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Post by DERRENMATTS on Oct 17, 2005 0:14:47 GMT -5
Yeah, but if I'm reading it correctly, he's thinking that's the starting 5.
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Post by mev17 on Oct 18, 2005 0:31:24 GMT -5
There is [glow=red,2,300]no way [/glow]I get rid of AJ. The only reason he has "disappeared" is due to an ankle sprain, not because of poor play. As to summer league, Perkins did not impress in summer league either, but now in preseason he is our best rebounder and shot blocker. AJ's performance last year during real NBA games means 1000 times more than any summer league action, and he showed he can be a player in this league, despite being in his first year out of a small, rural highschool.
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Post by DERRENMATTS on Oct 18, 2005 0:44:22 GMT -5
I guess you are a believer in Big Al Jefferson, Mev ;D
We don't need to worry about Al. He'll be fine. I'd like to see him with more muscle on his frame.
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Post by Celtic17 on Oct 18, 2005 0:49:16 GMT -5
I'd like to see him with more muscle on his frame. Kinda like Perk has done. Rid the baby-fat... |
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Post by DERRENMATTS on Oct 18, 2005 1:26:17 GMT -5
Perk has gotten rid of the body fat, and he's become rock solid. But he's not a bulding body building freak. I think this is how our trainers are trying to mold them. Get them strong, but not bulky so that they can still have fluidity. Jefferson may never have 24" pythons, but he should become a lot stronger than he was in his rookie season.
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Post by BCHISTORIAN on Oct 18, 2005 1:29:34 GMT -5
back to the topic: i want to see revenge tomorrow against the bulls
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Post by eja117 on Oct 18, 2005 8:43:55 GMT -5
Derren I guess I wouldn't suggest that starting 5 for the whole season, but I stick to my main thesis that the best players play and they play the most and right now Al J is nowhere near the best player on the team and I could see a day where he would not be the best player. All I'm saying is max out your options. If it's the best option to trade him for a Shaun Livingston or a Kirk Heinrich do it and don't cry about it. One of my other suggestions was to play Al J at center and give Reed B unit minutes so that Gomes or Reed are on the floor at all times. It depends on who plays best.
Right now the players playing best in order are something like this
Reed
Gomes
Pierce
Blount
DWest
Perk
all the rest in order something like this
Scala
Dickau
Ricky D
Raef
bynum
Borchardt
GG
OG
Incomplete due to injury and therefore worst
Banks
Al J
TA
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Post by DERRENMATTS on Oct 18, 2005 15:02:24 GMT -5
But you are looking only at the here and now. Sure Justin Reed is playing well now, but Jefferson can blow him out of the water in a matter of time if he can put it together and take steps forward. To say we should trade him to get a need, such as Livingston or Hinrich to solidify our PG spot, is not looking at the overall picture the right way. We should be concentrating on finding a way to get a Livingston, or Hinrich, to pair them up WITH Jefferson. Jefferson definitely has star potential and you take Justin Reed ahead of him just because at this time, Reed is ahead of him in development. Reed could turn out to be a solid contributor, but nowhere near the potential Jefferson has.
Now, if Ainge and Rivers both agree in unison that Gerald Green has the potential to be better than Pierce, I'd seriously look into trading Pierce for a PG who can lead a championship team. I'd do this because Pierce has the greatest value on the team right now and it will take a guy of his stature to bring in a PG good enough to be our lead man when we contend for the title. Plus, with our depth at the wings (Green, Ricky, Gomes, Allen, Reed), we should be able to take the hit of losing Pierce, all the more if Gerald surpasses Pierce. And with the upgrade at the PG spot, it'll create a different dynamics that enhance our team's offense.
None of our wings, aside from Pierce, can draw us a PG like Baron Davis, Shaun Livingston, or Kirk Hinrich.
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Post by eja117 on Oct 18, 2005 15:17:49 GMT -5
I also like to look at the potential of Shaun Livingston, and I think it's possible a team with Shaun and Reed would do better than a team with Reed and Al J. Especially since Reed can do some of what Al J can do. I don't even believe in potential. Show it to me. You can't put it in my hand. It's like some quasi pseudo science sixth sense thing. I believe in God, a stat sheet, what I see, hear, smell, taste,and touch and right now I see Reed and Gomes playing better than Al J. I see them filling up the stat sheet. I see they have never been hurt, whereas Al J has been hurt two or three times now. I see them hustle more than Al J. At some point you have to ask "Who do I think is more likely to make the Hall of Fame? Al J or Shaun Livingston?" I'd say it's 50/50 right now and you also have to ask yourself if Al Js trave value is as high as it will get. right now it's lower than it was at the beginning of the year. You also have to ask if Livingston's is about to go up. I don't think Reed or Gomes' trade value is as high as they will get. So who else has high trade value? TA? There's another hurt guy. I don't see how a guy is supposed to be so great if they are getting arrested and hurt. His trade value is also less than it was. You might get Shaun and something else good for Al J and TA. here's a question for you. All these great high school to pros kids. Did any of the ones who turned out great go out and get themselves hurt twice in their first year and disappear in the next summer league? Did any of the great players ever disappear in their 2nd summer league?
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Post by eja117 on Oct 18, 2005 15:19:49 GMT -5
When I said Al J trade value was worse than at the beginning of the year I meant worse than at the end of last year
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Post by DERRENMATTS on Oct 18, 2005 15:27:03 GMT -5
How about looking at it this way--you have to learn how to walk before you can run, right? Well, if you look at a baby crawling and take it at face value, you are saying that he cannot walk. Yes, that is true. Right now, this crawling baby cannot walk. But will he begin to walk? Of course.
Just by mere obsvervation, you can see how immensly more talented Jefferson is over Reed. Even just by doing things on natural instincts, he is better than Reed. Reed is more polished at this time in his executions on the basketball court, but how do you become polished? You get it by experience through practicing, going over routines, etc. Will Jefferson forever remain at this stage in his development? Well, is Shaq still a green rookie right now who looks light years away from being a great player?
Saying a player has potential means that you see things in the player that leads you to make an educated guess that with time and development, this player can make that potential into realization.
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Post by eja117 on Oct 18, 2005 15:37:16 GMT -5
Woah woah woah. Shaq didn't have an awesome rookie year, then get overtaken by a guy who warmed the bench. Al j was already ahead of Reed, then Reed came back and basically outworked and outhustled Al J and you can't teach that. It's not like Shaq reverted or anything. Neither did kobe or KG or any of the others in their situation. You are absolutely right that a baby has to walk first, but if there was a 1 year old baby that was walking, maybe even walking early, then a year later just stopped walking, then his "less talented" 2 year old brother got up and started jogging, and then set up a track with hurdles and clearly had plans to move into a running and jumping phase I'd say 'well I guess we know which baby is gonna be the star and who will be the runt" That is basically what may be happening here and has been for the last few months anyway. I gotta go, but I'll be back in like 45 mins
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Post by DERRENMATTS on Oct 18, 2005 15:50:32 GMT -5
I don't understand where you are getting this idea that Jefferson has regressed, though. Its not that Jefferson all of a sudden lost his abilities. He may not have put up the numbers we were expecting him to put up in summer league, but that doesn't mean we no longer can count on him turning out to be the special player he has the ability to become.
Take the baby scenario--if the baby starts taking his first steps and everyone gets excited, but then the baby falls on his butt and instinctively starts crawling again. Is there no hope for this baby to ever walk again? Absolutely not. Its called progression. You take steps forward and steps backward. For a player like Jefferson, who really came into the league raw because he didn't get adequate coaching in high school, you have to give him room to grow. But for what he's been able to show us in his rookie season, how he literally began to blossom before our eyes, we have a lot to look forward to. He was able to learn a lot of things in just a few months. Doc highly criticized Jefferson for his defense early last year in preseason, often saying that Jefferson is going to take a while to get playing time because of his poor defense. But encouragingly, in the playoffs, Jefferson's defense looked remarkably improved, as he was able to do some damage against Dale Davis and Jermain O'neal. It was only in spurts, but he has come a good ways in a short span of time.
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Post by Celtic17 on Oct 18, 2005 16:31:56 GMT -5
You guys... Love your conversations.  |
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