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Post by DERRENMATTS on Jul 2, 2007 15:50:17 GMT -5
Lets put it this way, Sheed has two years left on his contract. Allen is under contract with us for another 3 yrs? Yes, I want to keep the future intact but you gotta add some veteran presence like a sheed who will definitely help us on the defensive end. And I seriously doubt it would take much to get him here anyways. I think a roster of Sheed, Jefferson, Pierce, Allen, and Rondo could compete in the east possibly make the finals. The way I see it, with both Rasheed and Camby, they can certainly help us on the defensive end. Rasheed is also still a very good offensive player as well. But we need to get a Center who we can groom to be a part of the team for the next 5 - 7 years (hopefully longer). Rasheed and Camby are going to be here for maybe 2 years, and then after that, we are going to have to find someone else to take their place, and then we are going to have a revolving door effect until a good Center finally makes his way onto our team again. At least with Ray Allen, we have Gerald Green geared to step into his shoes when RA is ready to move on. I'd rather go after a young Center who has the ability to be a very good player for the next 10 years, and then not have to worry about looking for his replacement. Again, I don't think this team, with Ray Allen added to it, will be contenders. Even with Rasheed or Camby, I don't think we'll be contenders. We won't be contenders until Jefferson and Gerald Green are established star players--until Tony Allen and Rajon Rondo are established players. This won't happen for another couple more years, and by that time, Rasheed and Camby will be out the door. Get a young Center who can grow with Jefferson, Gerald, Tony, and Rajon. Then, with Perk, Powe, Big Baby, and Gomes filling out our roster depth, we will have a team with incredible team unity and chemistry, who will know each other in and out. Give them 4 years of development, and I think this will be our team: Darko Jefferson Gerald Tony Rajon Perk Big Baby Powe Gomes Pruitt |
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Post by freshnthehouse on Jul 2, 2007 16:22:53 GMT -5
I like the idea of picking up a guy like Camby, and once his contract is up, hand the reigns to Perk.
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Post by eja117 on Jul 2, 2007 19:37:56 GMT -5
That's three young guys we can build our team around, but that's not all. We also have Tony Allen. If he's healthy and he's back playing near the level he was playing at before his season ended, he's our starting 2. Tony's one of the few players we have on the team who can impact both ends of the court. He's a borderline star player when healthy. You're saying if TA is healthy he beats out Ray Allen? That's one of those things that probably should happen seeing as how he actually plays defense and it might be good to let the 32 year old be the 6th man, bit in reality I'm not sure he gets more minutes than GG. I think maybe this deal is just about money. 3 years of playoff revenue and nothing else. |
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Post by cfoo on Jul 2, 2007 19:39:57 GMT -5
kudos to eja for sticking to your guns.
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Post by eja117 on Jul 2, 2007 19:48:08 GMT -5
Well what else am I supposed to think? Has any team ever gotten to the finals, let alone won them, by pairing an expensive 32 year old hurt guy, with an occasional all-star small forward and some kids? Has trading a good backup point guard (who also just happens to be the toughest player on the team) and the 5th pick for a 32 year old hurt guy ever paid off for anyone? Plus the 32 year old guy in question isn't like KG or something. It's Ray Allen. One of those guys that when you talk about the top 15 players in the league that doesn't get mentioned.
Plus what does trading Delonte say to everyone else on the tean? You can work your azz off. You can be the toughest player on the team. You can be a fan favorite. You can be a top notch guy. You can prove yourself. And guess what. It doesn't matter cause in two seconds we'll trade you for a 32 year old hurt guy.
What that says to Gomes, Perk, GG, TA, and especially Powe is ....rent, don't buy.
DA. Frickin musical chair trades. Always a hurt guy who makes too much money. How much you want to bet Jeff Green and definitely at least two guys picked after him make the all-rookie team?
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cfoo
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Post by cfoo on Jul 2, 2007 19:57:40 GMT -5
I hear you eja. We are trying to do too many things at the same time instead of having a plan it seems to me. All of this being competitive and being able to attract players is a bunch of bs imo. If we built from within and won games and won championships players would want to come here. I like how the patriots build their team. They let the 32 year old aging guys who want too much money walk and they replace them with up and comers. I know we are dealing with guarenteed contracts but we could have let walker walk a long time ago. drafted roy last year. drafted someone at 5 this year and been a big time player in free agency next offseason and traded pierce or not. That's what I would have done, but DA has a different plan and we are treading water in a lot of ways. It might work out. We still are pretty young but it concerns me that we keep doing the same things.
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Post by mev17 on Jul 2, 2007 22:28:01 GMT -5
Hey DM. Glad to see you back from your travels. I won't repeat my analysis of the trade, but in summary I see alot of what you do. And it will be good for our remaining young players to gain more playoff experience ... it will make them better players down the road when they have to take over for the veterans.
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Post by DERRENMATTS on Jul 2, 2007 23:35:42 GMT -5
Yeah, I agree. Another losing season is not what I'm looking forward to. I think with the addition of Ray Allen, and hopefully an addition to our frontcourt, and possibly backcourt (though I'm not as concerned about our PG depth as I am with our Center depth), I think we will experience the playoff this season, and give the young kids a taste of the post season. We may not go beyond the first or second round, but just for them to experience it will be good for their growth.
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cfoo
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Post by cfoo on Jul 2, 2007 23:57:43 GMT -5
I see daggers raining down from Ray and Paul.
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Post by cfoo on Jul 3, 2007 0:27:41 GMT -5
This is one the hardest trades for me to figure out Derren. I love it. I hate it. But its Ray Allen.. RAY ALLEN! the thought of having a shooter like that come playoff time is exciting. How many times during games do you see Allen just knock down shot after shot. He's one of the best shooters ever. And one of the league's greatest assassins. Pierce has never played with a player like Ray. Ray has never played with a player like Paul. They have played with good players, but not of their caliber. With Jefferson and Perk inside, and if we get a defense it could be interesting.
Hopefully the fans will get excited and really get behind these guys. Maybe we'll have this team playing better than they are, and actually playing defense. I could see this team potentially getting on a roll if players get hot and stay hot. If Allen stays healthy there is no way you can double Paul. How do you guard Jefferson? We have the potential to destroy defenses if things get clicking. I may be carried away but it's true. We can't play a lick of defense, but how do you guard these guys if we get on a roll? Name me one other team that has the trio of scorers we do. Phoenix doesnt even have that. MArion, Amare, Nash aren't the individual offensive scorers that we have now. Think about it. We might not be as deep or well rounded as Phoenix or other offensive powerhouses, but if we get clicking and guys like Gerald, TA, Rondo and Big Baby show up. Teams have had good trio's in the past that looked good on paper and flopped, but it could happen where this team is better than expected.
On paper if you look at their career stats we have two bonafied 25 pt scorers in Paul and Ray. The only other team that has that to my knowledge is Denver. Add in Jefferson who averaged 20 ppg the 2nd half of last year, no other team can match that. We add a veteran pg and a defensive presence in the middle and I'm not saying we go far, but we could go farther than people expect, if things go right and players and chemistry develop faster than we expect. We didnt get Oden or Durant which sucks, but we did get an impact player for the here and now, and Allen is a guy that should actually impact this team more right now. I'm still not sure what to make of this, but people overlook that Allen was 5th in the league in scoring last year, and has been a top scorer throughout his entire career. Allen has always been an underrated gem imo. I guess the point is love or hate this trade, it's very hard to disrespect Ray Allen's game and what he can bring to this team offensively. If we are going to be an offensive juggernaut we might as well have the best scorers and we do now.
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cfoo
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Post by cfoo on Jul 3, 2007 1:26:04 GMT -5
I've also been looking at the age thing and most sg's of Allen's class usually see a dropoff in production around 34 or 35. Michael Jordan had his 3 best years from 32, 33, and 34 years old. He then retired when he could have kept on going, so the whole most sg's decline around 32 is not true. I looked it up. most sg's in nba history that are on the pace Allen has been on didnt lose a step until they were 34 or 35 which is the end of Allen's deal. So in other words more than likely we have the best shooter in the league fo rthe next 3 years to team with Paul. That's right about when Gerald should be ready.
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Post by BCHISTORIAN on Jul 3, 2007 5:58:16 GMT -5
i agree. just wanted to remind as well that jordan was on top level when he was 32,33,34. actually he was the most dominant in 95-96 season when he was 32.
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cfoo
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Post by cfoo on Jul 3, 2007 6:32:02 GMT -5
I'd like to get Pierce a championship and get him into the hall of fame. He is a great player that has played on some pretty bad teams. If we are keeping Pierce around we really need to get him a championship.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2007 7:34:26 GMT -5
Lets put it this way, Sheed has two years left on his contract. Allen is under contract with us for another 3 yrs? Yes, I want to keep the future intact but you gotta add some veteran presence like a sheed who will definitely help us on the defensive end. And I seriously doubt it would take much to get him here anyways. I think a roster of Sheed, Jefferson, Pierce, Allen, and Rondo could compete in the east possibly make the finals. The way I see it, with both Rasheed and Camby, they can certainly help us on the defensive end. Rasheed is also still a very good offensive player as well. But we need to get a Center who we can groom to be a part of the team for the next 5 - 7 years (hopefully longer). Rasheed and Camby are going to be here for maybe 2 years, and then after that, we are going to have to find someone else to take their place, and then we are going to have a revolving door effect until a good Center finally makes his way onto our team again. At least with Ray Allen, we have Gerald Green geared to step into his shoes when RA is ready to move on. I'd rather go after a young Center who has the ability to be a very good player for the next 10 years, and then not have to worry about looking for his replacement. Again, I don't think this team, with Ray Allen added to it, will be contenders. Even with Rasheed or Camby, I don't think we'll be contenders. We won't be contenders until Jefferson and Gerald Green are established star players--until Tony Allen and Rajon Rondo are established players. This won't happen for another couple more years, and by that time, Rasheed and Camby will be out the door. Get a young Center who can grow with Jefferson, Gerald, Tony, and Rajon. Then, with Perk, Powe, Big Baby, and Gomes filling out our roster depth, we will have a team with incredible team unity and chemistry, who will know each other in and out. Give them 4 years of development, and I think this will be our team: Darko Jefferson Gerald Tony Rajon Perk Big Baby Powe Gomes Pruitt With Rasheed signing with the Orlando, Darko has become an UR Free Agent. They don't have the money to sign him. You might actually get your wish if Ainge decides to do a S&T for darko. My only problem with that trade is the flexibility to sign Jefferson if we give up Theo's expiring contract. Is it really wise to get Darko at the expense of losing Jefferson? As much as i would love to get my hands onto a 22 year old 7' shot blocker like Darko, I'm not willing to give up any flexibility that'll cost us to resign jefferson. I'd take a chance with Sheed or Camby for two years than Darko for 4-5 years. |
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Post by clem on Jul 3, 2007 7:46:34 GMT -5
Hi I,ve been in and out the last couple of weeks myself.And have spent virtually no time blogging.So I got to say that night when i heard about the trade.We were sitting up at a restaurant in vermont and almost choked on my boneless chicken.But as the day,s go own I find myself starting to like the trade more and more.I also agree that Danny is not done dealing.But I have a feeling it is going to be for a couple of final year contract players.(I would like to see them sign B Knight to a i maybe 2 year deal now that he has been let go by Charlotte.And a trade i might consider and your all going to think i am nut's but Telfair and Scal to Miami for Doleac.He is in his last year of his contract and he would be a solid #3 center/PF,and a solid veteran In the locker room for a year.We don,t give up any key players and we should improve are cap space for next year(No Theo,Doleac or possibly Knight).Know matter who we get this year we will not win a title as they will need 1 maybe 2 years to jell as a unit.
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