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Post by DERRENMATTS on May 28, 2007 13:07:48 GMT -5
This is another tough question Ainge will have to make this offseason--whether he should hold onto the 5th pick and possibly upset Pierce to the point he wants out of Boston, or move the 5th pick in a package to bring in the veteran help Pierce is asking for.
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Post by FLCeltsFan on May 28, 2007 13:42:00 GMT -5
It is possible that he can do both. With the improvement from our core players who themselves are turning into veterans before our eyes, and enough spin about the player coming in, Pierce may be convinced to give it another year or at least until the trade deadline. I can't see Pierce being dumb enough to want to give away players or make a trade for a veteran that requires us to give up too much. Sometimes there just isn't a trade to be made.
If it comes down to Pierce or the pick, I would take the pick and get what i can for Pierce. I would rather stick with the youth movement anyway.
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Post by eja117 on May 28, 2007 16:21:41 GMT -5
I'm not making a trade that I wouldn't do if PP were happy just cause PP is unhappy.
Nobody is owed a ring. Especially not PP.
What ever happened to the days some of the best players that ever played at their positions (Barkley, Ewing, Stockton, Malone) could go a whole career without winning a championship without whining?
i don't think the Suns or Mavs are talking like this.
Maybe PP should look at Toine and realize he can be 4th fiddle on a team in three years or stick with this one.
Look at what the Lakers got for Shaq. Not much. We can't possibly expect to get anything so great for PP. PP is an overrated player. We talk about him like he's a top 5 player at his position. He's not.
He's also not our GM.
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Post by greenblood on May 28, 2007 19:39:28 GMT -5
Ainge may have to keep Pierce and keep the pick. The overwhelming majority of Celtic Nation believes Ainge should trade the pick for a J.O, K.G, S.M type veteran that is going to instantly turn the Celtics into a playoff team. Most likely, Ainge isn't going to have this option, unless Big Al is packaged along with the 5th pick. He also isn't going to get anywhere near equal value for Pierce. This is because teams that are in rebuilding mode, aren't going to mortgage their future to bring in a 30 year forward, who makes 20 million a year. NOT HAPPENING. I could see a team like Pheonix, Dallas, or Chicago making a run at Pierce in order to put themselves over the proverbial top. Unfortunately for the Celtics, they aren't going to give up their stars to get him because then they would not be improving their team, they would simply be breaking even. And, other than Chicago, do those other teams have any young talent that you believe the Celtics can build aroun? Josh Howard in Dallas, Boris Diaw in Pheonix?? I'm not excited. I know I have beaten this to death, but this is why the NBA has hurt itself. Several teams need to win a fricken lottery in order to vastly improve their team. A LOTTERY!!
Well, hopefully Ainge can finally pull a rabitt out of a hat and pull of an "Auerbachian" trade. Aren't the Celtics due for one?? Wait didn't we say that about.....
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Post by Roadrunner on May 28, 2007 21:28:04 GMT -5
Last year, the Celtics traded the #5 pick for Telfair & his gun collection. Keep the pick. Keep Pierce.
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Post by DERRENMATTS on May 28, 2007 23:09:35 GMT -5
We'll need to convince Pierce to hold his horses for another couple of seasons before we reach the top 4 level in the East (when Jefferson, Green, Rajon, Tony, Perk, Delonte, Gomes, Powe, Ray, and our 5th pick are all playing at the top of their games).
Will he be convinced that we will win a championship with these bunch of guys? I think if we are patient, and with another couple of key pieces, we can win a title, with or without Pierce--as long as our core young players reach their ceiling. That means Jefferson being a 20 and 10 guy, Green being a 20+ ppg scorer, Rajon being a top 7 PG in the NBA, Perk being a 10 rpg and 3 bpg big man, Gomes being a 15 and 7 guy, Delonte being an aggressive lights out shooter, Tony Allen coming back from his injury to be a dynamic player on both ends of the floor, Powe being a powerful player off the bench, and whoever we draft with our 5th pick becomes a star caliber player.
Some of these players will reach their ceilings--some will not. If Pierce doesn't think we'll win with these group of young players, Ainge should trade him now and get ourselves a player who will fit in with our future.
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Post by The Eye of the Q is upon you! on May 29, 2007 12:09:58 GMT -5
Pierce should keep his trapper shut and help make his teammates better. Keep the 5 and keep Pierce.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2007 15:31:09 GMT -5
Keep the pick, keep Pierce, get a new coach. It would be stupid to do anything drastic with the Celtic roster until they get a better coach.
Doc may not be a complete idiot but these are the facts. He's never won more than 45 games in a season. His Orlando teams were only a few games better with Tracey McGrady than they were without him. He's never made it out of the 1st round of the playoffs, including blowing a 3-1 lead in Orlando and getting embarassed by the Pacers in Boston. His teams have NEVER been very good defensively and Doc has done a terrible job managing a full roster during his stint in Boston.
If Ainge brought in a Van Gundy or Carlisle as coach, maybe you could justify making a big move because those guys might be able to do something if they add an O'Neal or Gasol to the Cs. But even if you brought those guys (or someone like that) to Boston, there's no reason to think Doc could do anything better than around .500 with ANY team.
Mike
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Post by FLCeltsFan on May 29, 2007 16:04:06 GMT -5
Welcome to CG Mike! Koolaid point for you! I have said all along that the weak link on this team is the coach. I don't want to give up on this group of players until we know what they can do with a real coach. Doc's inability to coach defense has really been a thorn in my side. The article in the NY Sun echoes my feelings on this (and yours as well, it seems).
Here is what the author had to say:
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2007 16:29:40 GMT -5
Welcome to CG Mike! SNIP The article in the NY Sun echoes my feelings on this (and yours as well, it seems). Here is what the author had to say: Thanks! Man, not playing Powe just drove me crazy during that 18 game losing streak. I mean, after you've lost 10 in a row...how do you not give absolutely EVERYBODY on the team a chance to play some major minutes, just to see what happens? As bad as it was to miss out on Oden and Durant, what really depresses me is that one of two things will happen next season. A. The team will win just enough games to make the playoffs, meaning they'll keep Doc around and totally waste the last years of Pierce's prime, or... B. The team flat out stinks to start the season, Doc gets canned, but all the proven coaches are already off the market. Mike |
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Post by DERRENMATTS on May 29, 2007 16:45:29 GMT -5
Welcome to our community, MBunge.
Fully healthy, we should win a lot more games and compete for a spot in the playoffs. I thought we should have done that last season, but injuries derailed us.
Hopefully Doc can prove us all wrong and coach this team to the next level.
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Post by ferbo on May 29, 2007 21:35:26 GMT -5
For $20 million a year, I could keep my mouth shut, smile, and be happy.
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Post by Rondo to Posey on May 30, 2007 17:15:00 GMT -5
But could you stand having to put up with Doc for 82 games?!
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2007 20:10:33 GMT -5
I'd go with whats best for the team. If we're better trading Pierce by all means get the best offer available. If not, lets make moves improve the talent on this roster and try to win as many ball games as possible.
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Post by eja117 on Jun 2, 2007 20:40:46 GMT -5
I don't think PP is worth much. He's like 30 with a very big and long contract and he never won anything. Shaq was traded years ago for Odom and Caron Butler. So what could we get for PP? Nothing?
I also think if Zach Randolph is the best we can get for the 5th pick, then we keep the pick
I still think we should make teams come to us. I think we should keep the pick and try to get Darko. Maybe we could try to trade away some minor stuff. Maybe we could take back something very meager and a not so good contract for Scala and/or Powe and/or Ray. Use the extra money on Darko.
This year the goal should just be two more young guys really breaking out (either GG, TA, or Rondo) and have the draft pick be fairly good. Make the all-rookie team. Also have guys like Wally and Perk be a lot more healthy and rebound well. Make the playoffs as a 7 seed. That's all. Nothing spectacular. Then make like a 4 or 5 seed after that when the draft pick and one more young guy gets better. By this time AL and one other guy is nearly dominant. Then be a 1-3 seed. 3 years. All our players are like 26 at this point. Yes. Yes I am willing to wait 3 more years instead of a stupid quick fix. Once they are 26 with 2 seeds I have like 6 years of happiness. I'm fine. I can do it.
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