Conspiracy theorists and extremists

[cfoo]

I don't mean any offense if someone here actually believes this stuff. But I've run into a lot of these conspiracy theorists recently. People that believe we didn't land on the moon and stuff. I watched this speech on jfk the other day where its made to sound like he's speaking up against secret societies and the ulliminatti and (censored). When if you listen to the speach its clearly taken out of context and he is talking to the press and talking about keeping secrets from the kgb and russia. What amazes me though is the amount of people who really believe this stuff though and are very aggressive in their beliefs. On the internet it's almost like someone with rational thought is in the minority. WAtch that video on youtube and read the comments. It's tons of people who really believe it. I'm an advocate of religion in certain regards if you are rational about it, because i do think it has very good core values at its core. But what amazes me is the amount of people who have no ability for any rational thought whatsoever. They believe one thing and thats it no matter how untrue it is. I can understand wanting to believe whatever you want to believe and living in some alternate reality dude, and whatever floats your boat. It's a free county but when these people start talking like everyone else is an idiot and have no capability for any rational thought whatsoever its kind of scary. I think the internet is a lot of that. Thing i tend to think a lot of these people are people who do follow religion they are decent people at heart and have good core values but their logic is really scewed. In turn you have other people on the other side of the fence who are just as bad. Who believe what they believe and are equally paranoid and vicious. Then you have good people just trying to do the right thing who's reality gets scewed from this stuff as well.

I don't mean this as an insult but there are a lot of clueless people out there. I have an open mind and don't pretend to know everything. I dont believe everything i read, and I agree there are things going on we dont know about. I also dont pass judgements and trust people and think the best usually which is to a fault sometimes. But most of this stuff i just look at the situation rationally and find the answers myself. I think it's possible ainge might have looked into dealing ray and rondo because it does make a tiny bit of rational sense. Ray's contract is up after this year. Rondo is going to be looking for a big contract. It might make some sense to move them for something better while we can and get a stud player entering his prime. But it also might make even more sense to keep them as well. That's rational thought and seein ghte bigger picture. This is just Ainge doing his due dilligence. It also wouldnt surprise me at all if this is something completely else and both these guys are here for a while. Ainge pretty much denied these rumors anyways.

The thing is sports has been relatively untouched by this stuff. There are these kinds of people everywhere but most of these people that make these really absurd claims seen to be in other aspects of reality. But the reality is there are people everywhere that really just dont see things rationally.

We really haven't come that far as a society and it's kind of sad. The thing is it goes both ways. Whats going on in the world has a lot to do with that. You have all these people with different belief systems and you have greed and apathy and all this stuff and it's really pathetic. What we are seeing is a shift and trying to get everyone on the same page and restore order in a lot of ways and that in itself is damaging because not many people just really listen.

[eja117]

I generally agree with you, but the thing is that by its nature a conspiracy is secret, so it's very difficult to disprove.

The other thing is that occasionally it does come out that such and such really did happen, like the Tuskegee experiment, where the government really did make men sick (I think in that case they gave thousands of black men herpes intentionally).

Further people get very upset about a lack of results that is understandable, so something needs to explain it, and they turn to conspiracies. Like why could one man working with practically a high school chemistry set come up with a cure for polio back in the 30's but 80 years later with all our computers and multi-million dollar research facilities we can't cure anything, and when we do it costs tons of money?

When you think of the moon landing, I have to hold out the outside possibility that it was all done in a studio for only a few reasons.

1 . NASA had the capability to fake it
2 The government had motive
3. The landing can't be confirmed by the surest method...direct observation, because there isn't a telescope powerful enough. The Hubble can see into space, but it can't see stuff like that.

So you can't just completely dismiss the possibility of conspiracies. I personally think that they sort of fall into the faith category which is why people get so mad, which is sorta what you said

[eja117]

The thing about sports situations is that teams are well known to lie, so you can't exactly trust them either

[cfoo]

Thing is I dont think these people are stupid. It's just speaks for society is all. The thing is if a lot of these people put their energy on something else and had guidance and worked on their issues that would be great. I'm all for fighting for what you believe in and free will and rights and all that stuff and if these people dont want to and arent hurting anyone thats fine. That's how they were raised and what they believe. But it makes more sense when you are fighting for somethign that's actually true and good for society. I'm not sure if lies and deceit are. It does maybe help conversation and having an open mind and seeing both sides so in that regard i have no problem with it. And most of these people say find the facts out yourself. So in that regard they aren't hurting anyone. But sometimes people in their beliefs go too far as well.

[cfoo]

I agree with you on the rondo situation eja. Aigne wouldnt say he's trying to trade these guys even if they were because they are on this team right now and he might not trade them so why hurt their value. So in that regard there might be something to it. I'm not denying the rondo and ray stuff. I just dont think its happening that soon if at all. I could be wrong. All this stuff could be a crock of (censored) too though.

I do think it's very possible ainge is looking at scenarios. Ray is up for contract and Rondo is going to want a large deal so ainge is weighing his options to see if we can possibly do better is all. Will it happen? Who knows. That's another story.

[cfoo]

Aug 18, 2009 9:38:39 GMT -5 eja117 said:

I generally agree with you, but the thing is that by its nature a conspiracy is secret, so it's very difficult to disprove.

The other thing is that occasionally it does come out that such and such really did happen, like the Tuskegee experiment, where the government really did make men sick (I think in that case they gave thousands of black men herpes intentionally).

Further people get very upset about a lack of results that is understandable, so something needs to explain it, and they turn to conspiracies. Like why could one man working with practically a high school chemistry set come up with a cure for polio back in the 30's but 80 years later with all our computers and multi-million dollar research facilities we can't cure anything, and when we do it costs tons of money?

When you think of the moon landing, I have to hold out the outside possibility that it was all done in a studio for only a few reasons.

1 . NASA had the capability to fake it
2 The government had motive
3. The landing can't be confirmed by the surest method...direct observation, because there isn't a telescope powerful enough. The Hubble can see into space, but it can't see stuff like that.

So you can't just completely dismiss the possibility of conspiracies. I personally think that they sort of fall into the faith category which is why people get so mad, which is sorta what you said

I agree with what you are saying. The government has done some corrupt stuff before. I wouldn't put anything past anyone and i dont believe everything i see or hear.

[freshnthehouse]

I don't believe most conspiracy theories, but I like what they stand for. As traditional media goes the way of the buffalo, we need more people that are trying to uncover what the government and big coorperations are doing behind closed doors.

For example, I dont buy a lot of the 9/11 stuff. It just seems too impossible to pull off. But I dont doubt for one second that our government would be capable of having a hand in this. Almost every US war in the 20th century featured some kind of incident that our government set up to help steer public sentiment toward going to to war. Gotta keep that military/industrial complex churning, baby.

If you are into documentaries at all,. I'd recommend netflixing-

Control Room (just watched it last night. it's about Al-Jazeera. fantastic movie)
The Fog of War
Why We Fight (this should be required viewing for every voting age american citizen)

[freshnthehouse]

Aug 18, 2009 9:18:52 GMT -5 cfoo said:

The thing is sports has been relatively untouched by this stuff.

I dunno about this. Check out any fame thread on any sports message board. Half the posts are from fans of people that are convinced that the refs have it out for them. Or any time the C's are in the lottery and don't get the top pick, this is proof positive to some fans that David Stern is out to get the Celtics.

[eja117]

I think owners have conspired to try to force cities to pay for fancy new stadiums or they'll supposedly leave towns.

I love it when NYC tells its teams? Where will you go? Tallahasee?

[freshnthehouse]

I don't think that is a conspiracy theory, that's a conspiracy fact. It's happened several times in Minnesota, with the North Stars actually moving.

[Roadrunner]

The UNLV '91 NCAA semi-final game against Duke was fixed. Larry Johnson; Stacy Augmon; Greg Anthony; Anderson Hunt; Moses Scurry; Elmore Spencer; George Ackles. UNLV won by 30-points in the Final the year before. Greg Anthony fouled out, which was a rarity for him.

[cfoo]

Aug 18, 2009 19:17:48 GMT -5 freshnthehouse said:

I don't believe most conspiracy theories, but I like what they stand for. As traditional media goes the way of the buffalo, we need more people that are trying to uncover what the government and big coorperations are doing behind closed doors.

For example, I dont buy a lot of the 9/11 stuff. It just seems too impossible to pull off. But I dont doubt for one second that our government would be capable of having a hand in this. Almost every US war in the 20th century featured some kind of incident that our government set up to help steer public sentiment toward going to to war. Gotta keep that military/industrial complex churning, baby.

If you are into documentaries at all,. I'd recommend netflixing-

Control Room (just watched it last night. it's about Al-Jazeera. fantastic movie)
The Fog of War
Why We Fight (this should be required viewing for every voting age american citizen)

That i can respect. What bugs me though is some of these people really are crazy though. A lot of people just don't understand what is going on either. Do you believe everything Obama says? I dont. I do think he has what he feels is the best interest of the country at heart though. It's kind of like a white lie. America is a business and its capitalism at its finest although I beleive we should try to keep those core values in tact and go about things the right way.

It's also how much of your life do you really want to waste on this stuff? As bad as things are and the crunch as it is, we still have options and can kind of go about our business and live our lives. Some people cant even do that. I agree all these gas prices and (censored) are a load of crap. I know how these companies work. The average consumer is like a cow being milked in a capitalist society and you have these large businesses being just that a business. We are paying for all sorts of (censored) we dont even know about. It isnt what we necessarily are being told either. I think we are becoming more globalized and trying to get everyone on the same page because a lot of these rogue countries are really (censored) with America and the planet. We are expanding, outsourcing, that stuff costs money. It's not necessarily right either. I dont think its ever right to take someones life and we do that. We spin it like its for the greater good and it probably is in a lot of ways, but thats also a bunch of bullshit. There are better ways. That i agree with.

Wars are started because of ignorance imo. We are an intelligent society and I know for a fact guys like Obama, Cllinton JFK are intelligent people and just doing their jobs and know this stuff. But then you have these crazy radicals who assasinate someone like JFK. What Obama is doing is going to piss a lot of people off and it is. I guarentee guys like Ainge and Belichek are the same way. They are intelligent people but it's a business to them and they have one goal in mind. I guarentee Ainge, Belicheck do things that arent honest and are cruel but keep that goal in mind. It's socialism in a way. It's capitalism and isnt necessarily what this country was really built on although it kind of is as well, because they are telling the truth as they see it in a lot of ways. IT's like a white lie. Then you have all these radicals that believe the bible to a t. I agree the core values of what the bill of rights states and ten commandments are beautiful things but you have this shift going on. You have all these radicals forcing (censored) down your throat and they are just as bad and it's ridiculous. Everyone thinks they are crazy and its like misery loves company.

I'm more of the belief of just do the best you can with what you have i guess. I'm not trying to change the world here. I have enough problems trying to get a steady job and (censored) and find a girl who wants the same things and a family and stuff. It would be worse if i had kids but i still wouldnt get overly involved. It's like get a life to some of these people is all i'm saying and it goes both ways. Find happiness in the simple things. If you dont like it do something else. There are alternatives and as americans we do have that.

[cfoo]

The reason i posted this is this guy i used to work with keeps sending me this (censored). I'm like i dont mind listening and find it interesting. But he's like forcing it down my throat like i'm an idiot. I told him when i worked with you were a nice guy and always helpful and i have no problem with you. You can believe that and you just believe something different and thats ok, but dont attack me because i dont agree. I'm a nice guy here and the fact i even listen to you states that. I feel his pain in a lot of ways because i know it goes both ways. Most people would just tell him he's crazy and to (censored) off. But i actually listen because it's sort of interesting and i think he's a good guy at heart with good values. I told him i agree that religion is good and has good values because i think that. I just dont believe everything i read. He is like brainwashed and cant think for himself or something. It's a little scary. It goes both ways is all. I dont believe the bible to a t. I also dont believe everything obama says. I also try not to get too wrapped up in this stuff and have a life and just be nice to people but its to a fault sometimes because i think the best of people and get hurt by all these people that cant admit wrong and tell their (censored) from their elbow. I've seen it from both sides. Then you have just good people in the middle who get sandwiched. Ultimately it's really not worth it. I know that and am smarter than getting involved in this stuff, that's the thing and i listen to these people and it's like dude calm down I'm a good guy here. But sometimes you just run into this stuff without even knowing it. Especially on the internet. People are jackasses and you don't even know it sometimes and neither do they because it's not face to face. I swear man if people said half the (censored) to me i've heard on the internet to me in person it would be a complete joke. It kind of pisses me off because i'm just trying to live my life myself and i dont like people (censored) with me. Dont get mad get even i guess.

[eja117]

Some conspiracies are probably a good thing.

Take for example the Roswell alien crash in the 1940s. Let's just say it happened. If that happened what I would expect to immediately happen is for a bunch of military scientists to show up and grab that thing. It's clearly property of the US, and has tremendous security and scientific implications.

I wouldn't want them to come out and tell everybody "Hey guess what. We got an alien ship and you don't". That would be incredibly stupid.

Some conspiracies are punished like Madoff.

Some conspiracies aren't very successful and eventually the market would decide and wouldn't support it any more. Like the way the NBA has to have the appearance of a fair draft and fair refs, cause if people think it's fixed they don't watch, which is part of why Pete Rose was banned for life.

Plus there's a difference between a conpiracy and a secret. A conspiracy is more like a plot. A secret is intelligence.

Tell your coworker to go out and start a newspaper, blog, radio station, or TV station and get a degree in journalism, so he can prove and reveal all these conspiracies. Tell him you'll read his blog or paper and watch his show and that you look forward to him proving and revealing all these conspiracies with full details and names.

[cfoo]

It's not so much that conspiracies are wrong its that people like to shove this down peoples throats trying to prove something to people that aren't really involved in it.