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Post by eja117 on Feb 10, 2007 14:36:52 GMT -5
You know what dude. I put up with a lot. A real lot. I'm not sure but i don't think I have ever called anyone here stupid or dumb or an idiot, and I sure as hell never asked if someone was hit on the head with a hoe. I also rarely if ever called anyone else's ideas ridicululous. I also basically never pulled one of these 4th grade type moves where I say "You are dumb. Prove to me this. Show me that. Never mind. You are just stupid. I'm gonna take the last word and switch the subject and then you better not respond." All I ever said was Doc wasn't that good, has mediocre stats, and shouldn't be watching his kid play ball while his team is in a monumental losing streak. I'd say that makes me reasonable, but aparently if you disagree that makes me dumb, stupid, and an idiot who was hit over the head with a hoe. Seriously Chief. Get a grip. And I don't want your respect.
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cfoo
Welcome To Celtics Green!
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Post by cfoo on Feb 10, 2007 14:56:40 GMT -5
I'm sorry. I have a grip. I'm just telling you how I am. I was trying to change the subject and you still wouldn't let it go. The thing is EJA I meant it when I said I had no problem with you. Most of this stuff I understand is just kidding around, including 90% of what I said, but there's a point where it's time to move on.
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Post by eja117 on Feb 10, 2007 14:59:55 GMT -5
Fine fine fine. I presented a lot of evidence. You presented a lot of counter evidence. I agree to disagree. I'm moving on. I won't list 35 point guards better than Doc unless someone has a burning desire for that.
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cfoo
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Post by cfoo on Feb 10, 2007 15:17:19 GMT -5
There probably are 35 pgs better than or as good as Doc. That's the silly part of thsi whole thing is you think I'm saying Doc was this great player when all Fresh and I said was that he was a very good one. The only thing I disagreed with was that you seem to think he was mediocre when he was actually very good. It's not that big a deal.
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Post by eja117 on Feb 10, 2007 15:24:31 GMT -5
That's a good point. It wouldn't be easy to rank Doc and it wouldn't be easy to rank all pgs ever. I got up to 27 in my head last nite, but my knowledge of NBA pgs only goes so far. Maybe I shouldn't have said not very good. Maybe I should have said overrated or he only had a couple good years or something else. Plus maybe the dumber thing was linking his playing to his coaching. Phil Jackson was not known as a great player but is known as a great coach, whereas Isiaiah is oppositte mostly. With all that mostly done now I guess the main topic on this thread was don't count out Sebastian yet and I agree with that.
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Post by eja117 on Feb 10, 2007 15:26:13 GMT -5
Good thing we mostly wrapped that up right before QBox and Derren got here, or I'd be in a lot of trouble right now.
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cfoo
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Post by cfoo on Feb 10, 2007 15:27:32 GMT -5
See as I was saying I tend to think the way Doc played could be good for players like Telfair and Rondo. If you read anything about Doc, or saw him play, he was basically a craftsman type and was a heady player and a hardworker. Regardless of how good he was, those were his strengths. I would think that those things would translate to being a good coach. That's just my opinion. And all I was saying was Doc is in his 1st year of coaching these guys and it might be too early to really tell if Doc is a good coach or not.
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Post by eja117 on Feb 10, 2007 15:31:40 GMT -5
Maybe the way he plays and was treated explains why he seems to like Delonte and Gomes so much. Maybe he doesn't identify with the whole instant millionaire blue chip Bassy ad AL J type life as much. Although you said him and DA were a lot alike, but they seem a little different about who they think are the best players
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cfoo
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Post by cfoo on Feb 10, 2007 15:33:53 GMT -5
Well you are judging how much he likes guys by how much he is playing them. Sometimes people are harder on people they like. You never know what someone is really thinking. IMO i dont think Bassy deserves to play. He sucks on defense and really needs to work on that before he plays.
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Post by eja117 on Feb 10, 2007 15:38:29 GMT -5
I also think Bassy is having a hard year. The guys on FSN last nite were explaining he started cause he earned the job in camp. Delonte was hurt, and he was just better than Rondo (not sure how much I believe that based on how Rondo played in the exhibitions), and earned the spot. Fine fine, but why did he fall off the map? And for all the talk about how bad a shooter Rondo is Bassy isn't so good either.
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Post by DERRENMATTS on Feb 10, 2007 15:50:58 GMT -5
Alright, getting back to the original concept of this thread, yes Bassy is having a hard year. He's grown up playing as a real PG, where he dictates and orchestrates the offense by cutting/slashing into the lane and roaming around the court, trying to create offense for himself and others. But Doc's offense just isn't like that. In our offensive system, our big men do just as much passing from the high post than our PG's, and the same with our wings. Doc's system isn't meshing with the view Ainge has when he went after Telfair and Rajon. Maybe its because of our injuries--but for whatever reason, we have not run the ball like how we were promised.
I still stand firm in my opinion that we aren't using both our PG's correctly. Telfair and Rajon are being handcuffed and taken out of their true exciting games. In our calculated offense (which takes so long to initiate), a guy like Delonte seems to put up better numbers. But in actuality, he's got the least PG skills and abilities of the 3.
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cfoo
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Post by cfoo on Feb 10, 2007 15:58:17 GMT -5
That is a good point about the calculated offense. This might be where Doc doesn't mesh. I kind of like the offense Doc is trying to run, but I'd also like to see this team run a lot more on top of that. These are things I'm unsure right now. Yes we are running a calculated offense, but does that mean that is the ultimate goal? From watching various teams develop over the years it seems like baby steps are taken. Where teams will concentrate on one thing as a base until they get it, and tehn add another. But you might be right, because Doc was never really a fast break type of guy, he was more of a calculated thinking man's pg if I remember correctly but he also did get out on the break and do a good job. The HAwks were an athletic team and Doc was the guy that used to throw passes on the break to guys like Dominique.
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cfoo
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Post by cfoo on Feb 10, 2007 16:19:19 GMT -5
I know what you are saying though Derren. You want this team to run like the Suns do and initiate the offense a lot earlier than the C's do. That's where I'm split. I'd like to have an in between where we run and are agressive at the right times and also have a halfcourt offense. I'd like the C's to be able to do both. I hope that is what the C's ultimately do. It's weird, earlier in the year we were getting killed at the end of games trying to play halfcourt against much more experienced teams.
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Post by eja117 on Feb 10, 2007 16:29:20 GMT -5
I haven't watched the Suns tons this year, but I'm not under the impression that when the game slows down that they crumble or anything. I'm sure Nash, Marion, and Amare can play in any style if needed. So I guess I agree with Chief on that too.
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Post by DERRENMATTS on Feb 10, 2007 16:34:03 GMT -5
Here's what I see that upsets me (again, refering to our calculated offense). The PG and Jefferson are set up on the weakside and Jefferson gets positioning on his man. But instead of feeding the ball to him, the play seems to be called for Gomes to get the ball on the other side of the court, so the ball gets swung that way. Jefferson was open, and he's on the weakside where there's only one defender. But the ball has to go to Gomes on the other side of the floor because that's what the gameplan was.
I just hate it when our offense takes half the shot clock to get started. First the ball is walked up the court, then it takes another 4 seconds for everyone to prepare for the play, and then the calculated play is run--guys start to move and get to their spots. By then, we hardly have enough breathing room for any errors.
We don't have to be mirror images of the Suns, but we've got to have more life than what we're showing.
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