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Post by FLCeltsFan on Apr 26, 2006 18:18:07 GMT -5
Perk is going to keep improving. He is in his third year but don't forget he played all of 19minutes his first year. He didn't get much time last year either. This is the first year that he has had any extended playing time. I fully expect him to come back next year with a mid range jumper and better defensive moves and to be a bit quicker. Jones will improve but will always be behind Perk in development because Perk is one of the hardest workers on the team. I expect Perk to become a very good starting center and Jones to develop into a good back up.
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Post by mev17 on Apr 27, 2006 1:36:26 GMT -5
I would love Jones to develop into a solid player, but two games against teams cruising into the playoffs is not enough to consider him a potential starter. Perkins may not be the flashiest offensive player, but I doubt Jones has ever scored 16 or 17 points in his entire life. From what I've read about him, neither in college nor in the NBDL did he ever show any semblance of an offensive game, whereas Perkins has flashed a jump hook and an up-and-under move. Plus Heinsohn and West have both said that in practice he shoots the mid-range jumper well.
Plus Jones will have a difficult time matching up vs starting centers because he currently lacks the strength. He is basically a tall guy who can run and jump -- reminds me of a young Elden Campbell in that regard -- but I have to agree with JHVOS and flceltsfan12, he is not at the same level as Perk.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 27, 2006 16:04:21 GMT -5
Perk is going to keep improving. He is in his third year but don't forget he played all of 19minutes his first year. He didn't get much time last year either. This is the first year that he has had any extended playing time. I fully expect him to come back next year with a mid range jumper and better defensive moves and to be a bit quicker. Jones will improve but will always be behind Perk in development because Perk is one of the hardest workers on the team. I expect Perk to become a very good starting center and Jones to develop into a good back up. I agree with this statement. Perkins is going to get better because of his work ethic. He's only going to get better not to mention he's only 21 years old (same age as me). While I expect Jones will be like our big man version of Justin Reed. Along as we have a combination of Perk/Lafrentz/Jefferson/Gomes I expect Jones to see spot minutes possibly around 5-10 minutes a game unless he becomes a Ben Wallace type player.
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Post by ferbo on Apr 30, 2006 0:52:31 GMT -5
One of the reasons the Mavs had a very good year is their 5 by committee. Diop wound up b eing the starter, and played good D and rebounded. Damp played better off the bench than he did starting. AND, the 3rd guy, Mbenga got enough time so that in the second Memphis game, when the other 2 got into foul trouble, he came in and got 7 minutes in the first half with good energy and hustle which enabled them NOT to use Dirk at the 5.
I think the Cs will need to do something like that for a few years at least.
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2006 12:38:45 GMT -5
One of the reasons the Mavs had a very good year is their 5 by committee. Diop wound up b eing the starter, and played good D and rebounded. Damp played better off the bench than he did starting. AND, the 3rd guy, Mbenga got enough time so that in the second Memphis game, when the other 2 got into foul trouble, he came in and got 7 minutes in the first half with good energy and hustle which enabled them NOT to use Dirk at the 5. I think the Cs will need to do something like that for a few years at least. We have our Diop in Perkins (whose better than Diop), Dampier isn't that great but hey he's overpaid like Lafrentz. And you can say Jones will be Mbenga with providing good energy and hustle.
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Post by DERRENMATTS on May 12, 2006 4:25:33 GMT -5
Hey, how's everything going for you all? Seems like the Celtics world is pretty slow going right now. Thanks for providing whatever news you can find, FL. It was fun reading through them. Things should pick up as the draft nears the corner.
Just thought I'd stop by and chip in on some thoughts that have been floating around in my head recently, regarding the future of our ballclub.
Looking at how our team is constructed, we are very heavily anchored on the perimeter. Our whole offensive game starts from the outside. The proven reliable players are Pierce, Wally, and Raef (not to mention Delonte and Dan Dickau) and they're perimeter oriented, as opposed to low post scorers. The biggest immediate improvement we can make for the 2007 season is to bring in a proven veteran big man who can score from the post and provide reliable rebounding night in and night out.
There's not much to chose from, since quality big men are like gold. Jermaine O'Neal is not going anywhere and I don't have a good feeling about Zach Randolph (though I think he's a very talented player). If Utah would be interested in moving Boozer for Raef and a future 1st rounder, I'd like to make that deal (the logic I use to think they'll make this trade is because Raef's contract will save them a bit of money). Boozer has solid rebounding ability as well as being a quality scorer from 10 feet and in.
I'm still high on Jefferson at PF, and between him, Perkins, Dwayne Jones, and Ryan Gomes, I really like the big man rotation we have (though they are still about 2 years away from really being consistent performers from game to game). But to have that veteran presence will give us a boost during the times when our young big men get lost or are being abused by the Shaqs, Duncans, and Amare's. I'm not the biggest Carlos Boozer fan, but considering who we have to choose from, he's the least far fetched. There's probably not much of a chance to get him anyways, but its just a thought to get us that go to low post scorer while we wait for Jefferson (and Gomes) to develop.
With our strong perimeter game, having that go to guy in the post who we can rely on, will balance out our scoring attack, and should be a big boost in improving our win/loss record..
Going back to our young big man rotation, a couple of years down the road, we will have ourselves are terrific stable of rebounding stallions. Perkins, Jones, Jefferson, and Gomes are all good looking rebounders, and they can cement our rebounding production from the C and PF positions (which has been sorely lacking for years and years). Perkins is a bullish rebounder, Jefferson is an instinctive rebounder, Jones is an active and athletic rebounder, and Gomes is a fundamental rebounder. When all 4 of them get their feet firmly planted in the NBA, we'll have a really strong core of rebounders. All 4 of them are capable double digit rebounders (yep, I have faith in DJ).
I guess I have my work cut out for me backing up my enthusiasm for Dwayne Jones ;D I don't question Perks' rebounding ability, nor his defensive abilities (shot blocking and positioning)--he's exceptional at both. I don't question his hard work ethics either, but we know nothing about DJ's work habits. He could very well be another hard working gym rat. He won't rebound or block shots in the same manner as Perkins, but I see him getting similar stats in his own fashion. I see a lot of solid growth coming from Dwayne Jones to the point where he can rival Perks' rebounding and defense. Whereas Perkins muscles his way, DJ outjumps and outquicks his way to grab rebounds. He's also long like Perk, which gives him added reach when extending to block/alter shots. And he's not a weakling nor a skinny twig. He's actually got a good sized frame and some muscle on his arms (slenderly muscular). The way DJ moved around the paint with his back to the basket gives me the impression that he can be a fairly decent contributor offensively. But his primary contribution on the offensive end will be off of offensive putbacks.
If both are given the 35 minutes of playing time in a simulated game, they both have the ability to grab 10+ rebounds, Perk using his muscle and DJ using his quickness and jumping ability. Both could probably swat 2 shots as well.
But here's where the diffence comes into play (and the point I was trying to emphasis earlier): DJ's athleticism could very well (not guarantee) move him ahead of Perk. DJ moves very well up and down the floor, and he moves really well laterally. He's actually one of quickest big men I've seen moving side to side. Mark Blount moves pretty well laterally, but DJ looks even better. Jones is able to shuffle his feet well with coordination in the crab position (knees bent, wide base, arms extended). Most big men simply can't do this, or move extremely slowly. You won't see Ilgauskas doing this. But DJ looks very natural. And to boot, he's also pretty good at running hard and changing direction. These physical abilities may prove to be more beneficial on this team because of how athletic we are and the uptempo style which we may be playing.
Perkins is a rugged and physical player in the post, and no doubt that he gives it his all. But his slightly below average mobility holds me back from anointing him our lock at starting Center. The game is more and more evolving into a faster style, where 7 footers run like deers and spot up for three's. But I want to emphasize the misconception that Dwayne Jones is weak, or has a weak frame. He's not a frail guy at all. He's got a big more meat than Blount, though that's not saying much. Hmmm... hard to pinpoint a comparitive player with his body style. He's not skinny, but he's not as big as Jermaine O'Neal either.
This is why, when I watch the both of play, I see DJ being the eventual starter over Perkins. At this point, I'm not keeping individual stats, or watching how they fair against competition. I'm just watching for their basketball skills and their body movements. Perk does really well playing physical defense by getting in his man's grill. But DJ can cover more ground in the paint and can actually run down smaller players on fast breaks.
Both guys may put up similar stats, but its the manner in which they play that I feel will determine who will come out on top.
BUT, I do not feel that either guy will be a top 5 defender/rebounder in the NBA. Top 12 is very possible. And this brings me up to the next topic: In order for us to be contenders, we need to get a top shelf defensive big man or a stud PG. Having star wing players is not the same as having a star big man or a star PG. At this point, since we have a potentially strong nucleus of big men in a few years (Perk, Jefferson, DJ, Gomes), it seems that we won't get badly murdered by running them against Ben Wallace, Rasheed Wallace, and Antonio McDyess. Of course, getting a stud who can hold his own against Ben Wallace would be tremendous, but what are the chances, right? So going after a stud PG may be the piece to focus on.
Nash and Kidd are aging rather quickly, and Andre Miller is not far behind (he's getting slower year by year). Chris Paul is untouchable. But there's Baron Davis, and if I remember correctly, there's talk that he's not happy in Golden State (or they aren't happy with him). Yes, his injuries are a concern, but I wouldn't let that stop me from getting him. His vast talents are too hard to ignore. He's a playmaker and a scorer--he just needs to buy into the team concept a bit more and I don't think that's out of the question, seeing how Doc has been able to get everyone (including a formerly unhappy Paul Pierce) on board.
Now, it'll probably take Pierce to get him, but lets weigh the options (I don't think GS would take Wally instead of Pierce). We get a top 5 PG (when he's healthy he's a top 10 scorer as well as one of the top assist guys in the league), we still have Wally (who can put up 20 ppg), we have a developing star in Gerald Green, we have an exciting player in Tony Allen (who will be a terrific backup), and we have Ryan Gomes, who can fill in at SF.
Running a team with a dangerous PG (Baron), a sharp shooting, muscle bound SG (Wally), a high flying scoring machine (Gerald Green), an instinctive scorer anywhere around the basket (Jefferson), and a rebounding, shot blocking presence (Perk, DJ, or someone else) looks like a highly effective starting unit.
To me, Ainge has put us in a good position to cushion the blow of losing Pierce with the young talents he's amassed at the 2 and 3. We are losing a star player, but we'll be getting back a star PG in return.
Well, those are the thoughts I wanted to get off my chest. I'll hopefully stop by sometime before the draft and let out more thoughts then. Boy, I can't wait to see who we end up drafting (if Ainge decides to hold onto the pick). Lot of places are saying we'll end up with Brandon Roy, who happens to be a solid, well rounded player. But he's another SG and I just don't feel we need to draft yet another one. Marcus Williams seems to be the highest rated PG in the draft. He's a terrific passing PG (more on the cerebreal side) but not athletic as I want my PG to be. I still feel that Daniel Gibson is Ainge's type, but I don't see Danny taking him with the 7th pick. I haven't seen Tiago play, but Shelden Williams would bolster our young nucleus of rebounders. It would be amazing if we can land a top 3 pick and land Bargnani, Gay, or Morrison (haven't seen Bargnani play in a game, but like many of you, I've seen his highlight clips and read his encouraging scouting report). But anyways, more on the draft talk as we approach D-Day.
See you all in June.
Derren
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Post by freshnthehouse on May 13, 2006 1:16:14 GMT -5
Good to hear from you DM. I'm not a big fan of either Boozer or Davis. Both of these guys have bad reps, Baron especially. He seeems like the kind of guy that is basically on cruise control for the rest of his career. He'll always put up decent numbers, but he'll never be a guy that leads a team to anything.
Boozer doesnt scare me as much as Baron, but his contract would make it tough for us resign our bigs. Lets al and perk both turn into good big men. And what happens to good big men in this league? They get paid. I dont see management giving AlJeff big bucks if theyre already paying Boozer 11-12 mill a year. And Id much rather see that money go to a low post scorer(al) than a jump shooter(Booze).
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2006 0:59:53 GMT -5
Baron Davis had a down year so I don't even remotely believe Davis is worth trading for especially if we're going to give up Pierce. A young pg prospect (West) + 1st round pick and contracts to fill out the salary issue. In other words, Baron Davis won't be in Boston and for good riddance. Don't know about you but I don't need to see an injured prone pg jacking up 12 threes a game.
Boozer on the other hand gives you rougly 16+ pts and 8-10 rebs per game. Is he worth 10-12 million? Not if Jefferson is going to put up those kind of production plus adding couple blks per game. Jefferson needs another year of shaping his body (rougly weighing 250lbs) and keeping his strength at the same time. He also needs to develop a 15-18 foot jumper so he can keep other teams big man out of the paint.
Its break it or make it year for jefferson. If he can't do it then I expect this rebuilding project to continue until we find a suitable big man to take us to the promise land.
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Post by ferbo on May 14, 2006 12:13:49 GMT -5
I regret that Doc didn't get Jones into some minutes a little earlier. With him, only thing can really do is see what he does in summer league and pre-season. He should be on the 15 unless something surprising happens.
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Post by Roadrunner on May 15, 2006 22:30:03 GMT -5
Its tough to bring in players w/ this system, because Doc won't play the youth until they deserve it in his mind. Perhaps w/ the off-season, training camp, will see what shakes in, and out.
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Post by mev17 on May 18, 2006 2:10:17 GMT -5
Nice to hear from you DM! Of course, now that I've finally read through your enitre post, it's past my bedtime! ;D
Not sure I'm sold on Baron Davis, even if he is a Bruin. I can't see losing an iron-man like Pierce who has finally bought into the system in order to get someone like Davis who misses so many games. I would sooner acquire a veteran point guard who is not a star but could solidify the position (Knight or Claxton, for example).
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Post by BCHISTORIAN on May 18, 2006 6:17:34 GMT -5
no baron please. only when it's raef, dickau for baron trade
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