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Post by DERRENMATTS on Jan 27, 2006 1:03:46 GMT -5
Basically, it was Ricky for Wally. Forget about Blount and Kandi, they're just throw ins.
So lets look a little closer at the two:
Ricky takes 17 shots a game and averages 19.7 ppg Wally takes 15 shots per game and averages 20.1 ppg ADVANTAGE WALLY
Ricky shoots 46.4% Wally shoots 49.5% ADVANTAGE WALLY
Ricky shoots 32% from 3pt land Wally shoots 40.6% from 3pt land ADVANTAGE WALLY
Ricky shoots 78.7% from the FT line Wally shoots 89.6% from the FT line ADVANTAGE WALLY
Ricky pulls down 4.5 rpg Wally pulls down 4.8 rpg ADVANTAGE WALLY
Ricky averages 5.3 apg Wally averages 2.8 apg ADVANTAGE RICKY
Ricky turns the ball over 2.7 times a game Wally tunrs it over 2.2 per game ADVANTAGE WALLY (but Ricky averages nearly double the amount of assists, so its really Ricky's advantage)
Ricky steals the ball 1.2 times per game Wally averages 0.5 spg ADVANTAGE RICKY
Ricky creates his own shots a lot better and we have to see how this affects our team when someone, aside from Pierce, needs to score.
I'm actually surprised to see the outcome of this quick comparison.
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cfoo
Welcome To Celtics Green!
Posts: 1
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Post by cfoo on Jan 27, 2006 1:21:24 GMT -5
I like the trade for several reasons
1. Wally is a more efficient offensive player than Ricky. He isn't the type of player that is going to dribble the ball as much, which will put the ball in Delonte's hands more and just create more movement of the basketball.
2. Ricky has better defensive numbers, but they are a bit skewed imo. If you watch the games you would realize that Ricky is one of the worst defenders on the team at stopping penetration, and is a big reason why teams get to the hoop on us at will. Blount is even worse. He has to be one of the softest players I've ever seen. I think we become a better defensive team because of these subtractions. Not that Wally or Kandi are much better, but this means more time for guys like Allen, Perk and Al.
3. We unloaded Blount, and we unloaded Blount's contract. Blount had to go. This gives Perk and Jefferson more time, which will increase our rebounding and overall intensity. Wally is also a true SF and should give us better rebounding than Ricky at that spot.
4. Gomes is actually going to see some action now that Reed is gone. I think the C's made the right choice here between Reed and Gomes. Plus we swapped Reed for a big body which I think is more what the C's need to shape out the roster.
5. We got a #1 pick. That is always nice.
6. Wally's contract is not that bad. We actually saved money by unloading Blount, because Kandi is going to walk after his year. Wally is signed for 3 years I believe which is about the time that Green will be ready to take over. He is a nice player to have until Green is ready.
Barring injury at pg or with Wally going down, I dont see how we lose in this trade.
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Post by mev17 on Jan 27, 2006 2:24:38 GMT -5
Excellent comments, CF00, I voted the same way. Also, nice analysis DM - reflects IMO how Wally will be a better compliment to Pierce. Plus he doesn't force as much off the dribble and can actually hit big 4th quarter free throws.
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Post by BCHISTORIAN on Jan 27, 2006 2:33:50 GMT -5
i vote yes.
it comes down to comparing ricky and wally. and the benefit for us is that wally is different player that paul while ricky is in many ways similar. wally is a very good shooter and that is what we needed. additional benefits is that blount is gone, gomes gets more playing time and we also got first round pick which should come when kg might be gone from minnesota.
the risk is chemistry
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Post by DERRENMATTS on Jan 27, 2006 3:08:12 GMT -5
I've seen games where Wally goes away from shooting and forces his dribble into the paint, where he doesn't look as comfortable. He needs to go with his strengths, which is shooting the ball. Wally will do well here if he learns how to find open spots on the court for kickout passes and to use picks to get open for catch and shoot plays.
I see Scalabrine benefiting from Blount's departure. He'll get more minutes, and as he does, he'll play a bigger role.
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Post by DERRENMATTS on Jan 27, 2006 3:40:47 GMT -5
For those of you interested in what the conditional 1st round pick we get from Minnesota entails:
a future first-round pick that will come in 2008 at the earliest. The pick is protected to No. 14 the first year, No. 5 in 2009 and No. 3 in subsequent drafts
This might turn out to be the best part of this trade. IMO, Minnesota is on their way down. They have no young talent to carry them as KG starts to age (I like Rashad McCants, but he's not a superstar in the making). In 3 years, if KG is still with the team, they will sharply be declining. And if KG is gone, even better--our chances of getting a high lottery increases.
Another note to add to the Wally vs. Ricky comparison, Ainge really stresses how he thinks Wally will be a better compliment to Pierce than Ricky was. Lets hope he is because I thought Ricky was a heck of a compliment, even though their playing styles were similar.
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Post by FLCeltsFan on Jan 27, 2006 7:41:27 GMT -5
My heart says I hate it because I love Ricky. He certainly makes the games more exciting and I just love how he always looks like he is having fun out there. I loved how this year he has been passing better and leading the team in assists. But the drawback to that is that he sometimes would pass when he should have taken the shot. That being said, my brain says this is a good deal for the Celts. It will open up more time for the kids and will open up the middle better for Perk and Al. I hate losing Ricky but I have to hope this will make us a better team over all. This will give GG a better chance of coming in and getting some playing time as well. Lost in all this is Dwayne Jones in the DLeague. He shows some promise. He is averaging 11 rebounds for the Flame. I expect at some time he will be brought up to give him a chance. He was a teammate of West's at St Joe's and may be a good fit for our young team.
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Post by DERRENMATTS on Jan 27, 2006 10:10:31 GMT -5
Initially, I think this isn't such a good trade. Losing Ricky hurts, because I too felt like he found a home with us. I'll have to say 50/50 for now. One thumb up, one thumb down.
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Post by VI_CelticsFan on Jan 27, 2006 12:50:00 GMT -5
Initially, I think this isn't such a good trade. Losing Ricky hurts, because I too felt like he found a home with us. I'll have to say 50/50 for now. One thumb up, one thumb down. That's how I feel as well Derren.
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Post by The Eye of the Q is upon you! on Jan 27, 2006 13:20:29 GMT -5
We did well on the Ricky for Wally comparison. Very well.
Now the 100 million dollar question is: How well will Pierce and Wally get along? Can they work together and turn this season around? How well will they work with the kids?
Time will tell.
Doc should have an easier time managing minutes.
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Post by Jambr380 on Jan 27, 2006 16:19:20 GMT -5
For everyone saying that because Ricky and Blount's contracts add up to cancel out Wally's enormous contract, I say GET A CLUE...we could have traded Blount straight up for Kandi and been out of his contract. Ricky was a hot hot hot trade commodity and we ended up getting yet another guy who "works hard" and has banged up knees. It's not that I couldn't see trading Ricky, or even trading Ricky for someone who is about the calibur of Wally (even though I think we could have done better), it's just that Wally makes way too much money...if we can somehow dump Raef's contract, then I will be okay with it, but as it is now, we have VERY little money to spend this coming offseason and as controvertial as he can be, someone like Artest fits the kind of player (not personality) that we needed...That being said, Banks being a throw in is sortof a slap in the face, as he was a decent commodity as well...
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Post by mev17 on Jan 28, 2006 3:53:42 GMT -5
Minnesota would not have traded Kandi straight up for Blount. They wanted us to take a contract in return, reportedly Hudson's contract. Ditto with Memphis; we wanted Wright but they wanted us to take Cardinal. The reason Blount rumors swirled for a while was that the teams we were talking to did not want to take Blount and keep all their current long contracts as well. And even if such a trade occurred, Kandi's expiring contract would not have put us below the cap. And keep in mind cap space is not necessarily the road to the promised land. Utah and Atlanta have had plenty of cap space in recent years, yet they are hardly making a push towards the playoffs.
And not only does Wally make less than Blount and Davis combined, but the $ comes off the books sooner as Blount's contract lasts longer. Wally has managed to play 81 games last year and every game this year, putting up the best numbers of his career, so he is not the damaged goods some make him out to be. This trade may not make us dramatically better, but it certainly is not the disaster some fear it will be.
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Post by eja117 on Jan 28, 2006 12:20:34 GMT -5
I don't recall thinking Ricky was such a great defensive player when Rip Hamilton was making buzzer beaters over him with less than a second to go or when the Cs were getting embarrased in the playoffs.
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Post by Roadrunner on Jan 28, 2006 12:54:11 GMT -5
I like the trade from a basketball point of view, though from a personally level, its hard to part RD. However, one aspect that I like about the trade is the character of Szcierbiak. An intense competitor, who is passionate about basketball. Hopefully, Wally will be able to inspire his teammates.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2006 14:06:13 GMT -5
It's hard to give up a player like RD but in the end we got a player in Wally who compliments pp more than RD does. Also, Wally is more of a SF than RD will ever will be which allows doc to put Pierce at his natual position which is hte SG spot.
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