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Post by jrmzt on Nov 20, 2009 22:53:37 GMT -5
coupla things I took from this
1. Ray still looked full of energy. If I'm not wrong he played the whole 4th quarter. And hes still making plays and shooting except for that last turnover
2. Sheed was way more useful down low than from the 3 pt line. Sure he is a big man that can shoot the 3 but the way Big Baby and Perkins dominated Dwight down low last year, Doc should done that as well this game.
3. Refs are making some of the worst calls I've seen so far. If this continues into the playoffs, then the game has changed and teams will have to play an even less physical style of basketball if thats even possible. The refs are ruining the game.
4. WE SHOULD NOT have gotten ourselves in a 16 point hole. Making a comeback is harder than protecting a lead. It means having to shoot without rhythm and making sure your shots go in even if it means forcing em. Its ridiculous how for the past few games we never play well at the start. This has got to change.
5. It looks obvious that KG has not fully recovered. He missed shots that he would usually make. Shots that force teams to spread out their defending coverage and allowing us to get into the paint more. Pierce and Ray had to drive into 2-3 defenders so many times..
6. Perkins has every right to be pissed at some of the calls he got..Commentator said that Perkins was not happy with team practices not being as intense as before. Its definitely showing in their game.
If this continues, even home court advantage won't get us to the Finals to contend for another ring. Dwight wasn't exactly dominating, neither was Rashard...They don't have Jameer, and the only one who played well was Pietrus. With 20 turnovers, we could have won this..I just have no idea what the Cs are doing anymore.
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Post by Roadrunner on Nov 20, 2009 23:31:07 GMT -5
Poor loss. If BOS wants to win the NBA championship, it has to win games vs. the better teams, esp at home.
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Post by FLCeltsFan on Nov 20, 2009 23:44:16 GMT -5
When a team is 2-19 from beyond the arc the coach has got to say enough! They have been over using the 3 point shot and have not been hitting them. When they aren't hitting the jumpers they have to take the ball inside. They are settling for 3's and not making the extra pass to find the easy score. Rondo just didn't have it tonight. He wasn't aggressive and so the team wasn't aggressive. The defense was weak except for in spurts and the shooting was atrocious. Next up the Knicks... if we don't beat them by a lot, Doc needs to go back to square one with this team.
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Post by jrmzt on Nov 21, 2009 0:05:15 GMT -5
Somehow I get the feeling that the team is about as fired up as Doc is. I mean Doc is good but I from the wired ingame huddles, although what we are allowed to listen isn't much, it just doesn't sound like he was really pushing his team. Allowing them to take that many 3 pointers no matter how good a team is cannot be the gameplan. Even when you're down 5, you've gotta recognize that Dwight is in foul trouble and chances are that if you drive in, he either fouls you and you go to the line or he backs off and u get easy points.
And yeah Rondo just didn't look aggressive at all. His only highlight of the night was the pretty pass to a streaking Ray Allen from behind. Besides that, we didn't see him go to the basket and take advantage of his speed and age against the older slower Jason Williams.
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mev17
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Post by mev17 on Nov 21, 2009 0:20:36 GMT -5
We have only two wins so far against teams above .500, including the 6-5 Bulls. We are 2-3 overall against teams with a winning record, having lost our last three in a row. If it wasnt for all the bad teams on our schedule so far, our record would be terrible. And we have lost 3 of our last 5 at home, something that would have been unthinkable from the 2008 team we are allegedly better than.
Even after taking time to cool-off, I am irritated at how poorly we are playing. We are not remotely a championship caliber team, and the fact we have some new faces is no excuse, Orlando has new faces and is missing its star point guard. We simply do not play good basketball anymore. We are inconsistent at best and plain STUPID at worst. That turnover by Ray Allen was embarrassing, and the dumb shot by Pierce on the next possession was almost as bad. A championship experienced team should know how to execute and get good shots, especially since our starters (and Eddie House) are on their third year together.
The only consolation is that it is only November -- I can only hope this will be the mirror image of last year, which started out impressively but ended poorly. But to turn it around, each player has to go back to the drawing board and re-think their role on the team, and the coach needs to re-visit our offensive and defensive schemes. Either they are flawed or our players have forgotten how to execute. And frankly, there is no excuse for that. This is more than a hiccup -- something is seriously flawed with this team, and a trade to add another weapon sounds awfully good right now.
As negative as I sound, this is mild compared to how I felt an hour ago. All I know is that our problems won't just fix themselves over time. If this team tries too hard "not to panic" they may never straighten themselves out. Like the Yankees in baseball this year, it is either championship or bust with this team -- and our current level of play is simply not acceptable, and patience IMO is not the answer. Other teams have changed their rosters and are playing better than we are -- such as Orlando, Phoenix and Dallas. There is muchh work to do if we are going to come close to competing for a championship.
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Post by afceltic on Nov 21, 2009 1:52:01 GMT -5
For one thing they need to stop feeding Perk in the post because he has terrible hands and is a turnover waiting to happen. Perk doesn't need any plays run for him. Let him concentrate on offensive rebounding or getting a pass off of someone else's penetration.
Perk's TO's and poor shot attempts in one on one situations in the 1st QTR had a big hand in the Magic getting out to that big lead. And it didn't help that Pietreous hit everything when most of his shots were terrible shots that were covered and not in the flow of the offense.
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Post by jrmzt on Nov 21, 2009 2:14:01 GMT -5
Pierce was guarding Pietrus and left him open. We should have learned that after a few shots going in, we can't leave any of em open..and yet we did.
One thing we are lacking is a scorer..I mean you can argue we have KG Ray and Pierce but none of em have come up big this season.. Just looking around the league and I see Lebron with 40, Carmelo with 37, Durant 35, Rudy Gay 31, DWade 30...Everyone other good team seems to have a good scorer...Pierce is averaging 18 PPG, Ray is averaging 15 ppg.. I just don't think we can win with just average double digits from multiple players.. The Lakers have Kobe, the Nuggets have Carmelo, even the Bucks have Brandon Jennings...During our championship run, we had Pierce scoring high. So in effect, what I'm saying is that although we play great defense, we have no great scorer. I've yet to see Pierce put up 30 this season and overall, our 3 point shooting numbers are way way down. Considering we have Ray who is one of the all time 3 point shooting leader and Pierce who is as clutch with the 3 as they get, how did we suddenly lose all our offensive weapons?
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Post by afceltic on Nov 21, 2009 5:14:45 GMT -5
The big three averaged 19 PPG in our championship year. We will never have a guy averaging much more than that with these guys. I think the problem on offense is that they feed Perk too much and when Ray seems to get hot, they stop getting him the ball. As a team we are doing a very poor job of riding the hot hand. Part of that is on Rondo, but it's not just him, we as a team are being too unselfish. We always seem to make the extra-extra pass when we don't need too.
If someone is hot, ride them out until they go cold. We did a great job of doing that in 2008, not so much this year.
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celtics2
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Post by celtics2 on Nov 21, 2009 6:36:28 GMT -5
I still say we're doing fine. Just a shooting slump. We lost by 5 shooting 30/87 and 2/19 threes. Once we snap out of it things will change. I am only worried about Rondo. No improvement, none. I expected him coming out with guns blazing.
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mev17
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Post by mev17 on Nov 21, 2009 11:05:41 GMT -5
But a big reason IMO for the shooting slump is bad shot selection, especially too many 3s. If shots aren't dropping they should get try to get to the FT line.
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Post by jrmzt on Nov 21, 2009 12:08:34 GMT -5
The big three averaged 19 PPG in our championship year. We will never have a guy averaging much more than that with these guys. That said, we look at the Lakers and how they have Kobe, Pau, Odom, Bynum..they have just as many scoring options as us and yet they always have a stand out each night while the others tend to do pretty well too. I think you're right when you say Rondo isn't feeding the hot hand enough. Hes trying to do too much and get too many involved. Plus the amount of open looks he got from Jason Williams last night...if he only had a long jumper he can rely on when his team goes cold.
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cfoo
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Post by cfoo on Nov 21, 2009 12:50:46 GMT -5
It might be a distribution issue. If Sheed is going to just shoot it dont give him the ball so much. It might be as simple as that.
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Post by FLCeltsFan on Nov 21, 2009 13:31:16 GMT -5
For one thing they need to stop feeding Perk in the post because he has terrible hands and is a turnover waiting to happen. Perk doesn't need any plays run for him. Let him concentrate on offensive rebounding or getting a pass off of someone else's penetration. Perk's TO's and poor shot attempts in one on one situations in the 1st QTR had a big hand in the Magic getting out to that big lead. And it didn't help that Pietreous hit everything when most of his shots were terrible shots that were covered and not in the flow of the offense. I don't agree. Perk has is shooting 57% this season and his hands are no worse than anyone else's on the team. Last night he was 2-3 from the field and had just 1 turnover. He did however have 5 fouls, at least 3 of which were on terrible calls by the refs. Perk wasn't the reason the Celtics dug the 16 point hole. Much of it was a failure of the Celtics to play defense and allowing the Magic too many open looks which they converted along with the Celtics inability to hit any of the many 3 pointers they hoisted. Also KG's inability to tip in a ball or make a layup. KG was 5-13 last night. Sheed was 4-16 and 0-8 beyond the arc. If I was going to stop feeding anyone, it would be Sheed beyond the arc. Turnovers weren't the problem last night. They committed 12 of them and that is fewer than they usually do. Rondo and PP each had 3 and Ray had 2. Like I said, Perk only had 1 so when he got the ball he either scored (2 times out of 3) or passed it back out.
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Post by FLCeltsFan on Nov 21, 2009 13:42:21 GMT -5
But a big reason IMO for the shooting slump is bad shot selection, especially too many 3s. If shots aren't dropping they should get try to get to the FT line. I absolutely agree. Their shooting slump is being fueled by the fact that they are settling for way too many 3's and those 3's aren't falling. They were 2-19 from beyond the arc last night. When those shots aren't falling, they need to get to the hoop and forget about the outside shot for that game. But to continue to bomb away from out there when they aren't going in is going to continue to lose games for this team. But then again, KG couldn't seem to tip a ball in last night. I counted 6 different tip ins or layups that he missed. I'm beginning to think that the problems are due to a lack of focus and lack of ubuntu. They aren't trusting each other on defense and they aren't playing the team defense that we have seen in the past. They also aren't passing the ball but are taking too many quick shots, mostly from outside. They need to go back to square 1, watch a lot of tape and get back to playing like they did in the first 5 games.
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Post by afceltic on Nov 21, 2009 17:28:16 GMT -5
For one thing they need to stop feeding Perk in the post because he has terrible hands and is a turnover waiting to happen. Perk doesn't need any plays run for him. Let him concentrate on offensive rebounding or getting a pass off of someone else's penetration. Perk's TO's and poor shot attempts in one on one situations in the 1st QTR had a big hand in the Magic getting out to that big lead. And it didn't help that Pietreous hit everything when most of his shots were terrible shots that were covered and not in the flow of the offense. I don't agree. Perk has is shooting 57% this season and his hands are no worse than anyone else's on the team. Last night he was 2-3 from the field and had just 1 turnover. He did however have 5 fouls, at least 3 of which were on terrible calls by the refs. Perk wasn't the reason the Celtics dug the 16 point hole. Much of it was a failure of the Celtics to play defense and allowing the Magic too many open looks which they converted along with the Celtics inability to hit any of the many 3 pointers they hoisted. Also KG's inability to tip in a ball or make a layup. KG was 5-13 last night. Sheed was 4-16 and 0-8 beyond the arc. If I was going to stop feeding anyone, it would be Sheed beyond the arc. Turnovers weren't the problem last night. They committed 12 of them and that is fewer than they usually do. Rondo and PP each had 3 and Ray had 2. Like I said, Perk only had 1 so when he got the ball he either scored (2 times out of 3) or passed it back out. If that is all they credited Perk with TO wise, they were very nice to him and gave them to the passers that hit him in the hands in the lane. Rondo is shooting over 50% too, but as we all know he is a very poor shooter. Don't get me wrong I like Perk, but we shouldn't be running offensive sets for him. Not at much as they have, we have way too many better options on this team to waste possessions on Perk. With all do respect I think you love of Perk is skewing your opinion of his offensive game. And I agree with Sheed too. He's in a funk and needs to earn his shots back. Pierce and Ray should be our primary scores until Sheed gets out of his funk and KG gets his legs back. But I think Ray needs more shots than anyone. They seem to forget that he's on the team for stretches and he's our best shooter. If the team is in a shooting funk, let our best shooter who happens to be one of the best in NBA history, lead us out of it.
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