For Conspiracy Theorists..... « Thread Started on May 19, 2010, 9:45am »
If odds held, the Wizards should have picked 5th. Yet they defied odds and ended up with the #1 pick. This is after trading Jamison to the Cavs for basically nothing. Could Herr Stern have promised them the #1 pick for helping him get his Kobe/ LeBron finals? (Celtics had other ideas though) This was mentioned on the Magic boards last night. I didn't think of it. But it does make you wonder....
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Re: For Conspiracy Theorists..... « Reply #2 on May 19, 2010, 3:03pm »
Oh come now. Plenty of times a lesser chanced team won the no.1 pick. As the commentators said, only 4 times ever since the lottery started, have the team with the worst record ever won the pick. And I doubt Stern promised them the pick just cause of Jamison because after the Arenas thing, they were basically trying to get rid of anyone and everyone to get past that part of the franchise's history. I mean was it also a conspiracy when the Lakers got Gasol for practically nothing?
Oh come now. Plenty of times a lesser chanced team won the no.1 pick. As the commentators said, only 4 times ever since the lottery started, have the team with the worst record ever won the pick. And I doubt Stern promised them the pick just cause of Jamison because after the Arenas thing, they were basically trying to get rid of anyone and everyone to get past that part of the franchise's history. I mean was it also a conspiracy when the Lakers got Gasol for practically nothing?
Agreed. There is nothing out of the ordinary about someone in the number 5 spot winning the lotto. heck, i bet more teams in the 5 spot have won it than teams in the #1 spot.
And if anyone believes this stuff (the draft is rigged, the refs are rigged, david stern is darth vader, etc), why would you continue to watch basketball? do you even consider the celtics the champs in 2008, since it's obviously all pre-determined? some kooks believe that the KG trade was orchestrated with help from the league.
And slightly off-topic, but the next anyone complains about the Celtics getting hosed by the lottery, I'll point to the sad plight of the Timberwolves. No other team comes close to having that kind of bad luck. In something like 13 lotto appearances, the wolves have never moved up in the draft, and have actually fallen back in the draft 7 different times.
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Re: For Conspiracy Theorists..... « Reply #5 on May 19, 2010, 9:48pm »
No proof, though one has to wonder. In WAS, basketball was dead, thanks to G Arenas. Then, the team traded its 2 best assets for 0. The wonder is, does the NBA lotto work for teams that are finished, or big city markets?
Oh come now. Plenty of times a lesser chanced team won the no.1 pick. As the commentators said, only 4 times ever since the lottery started, have the team with the worst record ever won the pick. And I doubt Stern promised them the pick just cause of Jamison because after the Arenas thing, they were basically trying to get rid of anyone and everyone to get past that part of the franchise's history. I mean was it also a conspiracy when the Lakers got Gasol for practically nothing?
Agreed. There is nothing out of the ordinary about someone in the number 5 spot winning the lotto. heck, i bet more teams in the 5 spot have won it than teams in the #1 spot.
And if anyone believes this stuff (the draft is rigged, the refs are rigged, david stern is darth vader, etc), why would you continue to watch basketball? do you even consider the celtics the champs in 2008, since it's obviously all pre-determined? some kooks believe that the KG trade was orchestrated with help from the league.
And slightly off-topic, but the next anyone complains about the Celtics getting hosed by the lottery, I'll point to the sad plight of the Timberwolves. No other team comes close to having that kind of bad luck. In something like 13 lotto appearances, the wolves have never moved up in the draft, and have actually fallen back in the draft 7 different times.
It's nto that it's fixed fresh, but it's naive to think that the nba isn't a business and david stern is out for the best interest of that business. If you think huge corporations don't do shady things and shape things a certain way that's in their best interest that is also very naive to think. I see it every day. Have you ever asked yourself why you are really paying $3 a gallon for gasoline? That price is fixed in a way. Yeah it's not as simple as that. But not everything is all roses either.
There's a difference between being a conspiracy theorist with no factual backing and being a realist. There is a lot of (censored) going on in this world right now that isn't all roses.
Saying Stern would never do such a thing is just as ridiculous and naive.
Yes and Dwight Howard isn't on steroids either. Look at the guy. if that isn't factual evidence I don't know what is. Minus him actually being caught.
That goes for the celtics too. I tend to think they are one of the more class organizations in sports for sure, but I would be kidding myself if there wasn't stuff that goes on behind the scenes. Reggie Lewis was using cocaine. They aren't saints either.
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Re: For Conspiracy Theorists..... « Reply #7 on May 20, 2010, 12:08am »
Hmm if you said Iguodola was on steroids, I would agree because he looks like one huge ball of muscle..but Dwight doesn't look like he is. Sure I know he looks big and all but hes not exactly Arnold. Hes actually pretty lean and muscular in the areas which he develops the most for his game such as his shoulders and legs and judging by the videos of his workout routines, its not hard to see how he got big. Plus black men tend to have that gene that allows em to grow bigger much faster.
And yeah I agree..Stern does have his motives..I'd be a fool to think Stern was just innocently sitting on the wall and not manipulating things. However, if the NBA only works for big city markets then we should have gotten Tim Duncan over the Spurs and anyway, it doesn't really matter if Washington gets the no.1 pick and takes John Wall.. hes not a game changer. He may end up as good as CP3 but playing with Blatchay and Arenas isn't exactly going to win a title for him.
It's nto that it's fixed fresh, but it's naive to think that the nba isn't a business and david stern is out for the best interest of that business.
This is true, but the stuff I mentioned (rigging the draft, refs throwing games, etc) isn't in the best interest of the game. The short term gains (getting the teams you want in the play-offs) don't come close to making up for the long-term damage (people find out, league ceases to exist) that would happen if the public found out. Owners are smart. They know that sports have been a money maker for over a century, and should continue to be for decades to come. So what I'm saying is, it's not that I don't believe that they'd do shady stuff to improve the league, but the shady stuff that some fans think they'd do doesnt make any economic sense.
Quote:
Yes and Dwight Howard isn't on steroids either. Look at the guy. if that isn't factual evidence I don't know what is. Minus him actually being caught.
Just because a guy is built, doesn't mean he's on steroids. There's been plenty of guys that muscular before, it's just that most of them werent seven feet tall.
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Re: For Conspiracy Theorists..... « Reply #9 on May 20, 2010, 8:55am »
Fresh is right. Whatever the potential gains are, they are dwarfed by the risks of being found out and losing all credibility with the public. There is no fixing going on. If there were, why is Durant playing in OKC? Of all the places to bury him, when Stern (in theory) could have easily arranged to have him in Boston. You can always find some random coincidence and build it up into some grand conspiracy if you want to, but that doesn't make it plausible.
It's nto that it's fixed fresh, but it's naive to think that the nba isn't a business and david stern is out for the best interest of that business.
This is true, but the stuff I mentioned (rigging the draft, refs throwing games, etc) isn't in the best interest of the game. The short term gains (getting the teams you want in the play-offs) don't come close to making up for the long-term damage (people find out, league ceases to exist) that would happen if the public found out. Owners are smart. They know that sports have been a money maker for over a century, and should continue to be for decades to come. So what I'm saying is, it's not that I don't believe that they'd do shady stuff to improve the league, but the shady stuff that some fans think they'd do doesnt make any economic sense.
Quote:
Yes and Dwight Howard isn't on steroids either. Look at the guy. if that isn't factual evidence I don't know what is. Minus him actually being caught.
Just because a guy is built, doesn't mean he's on steroids. There's been plenty of guys that muscular before, it's just that most of them werent seven feet tall.
\
True but these huge corporations which the NBA is, have ways of circumventing the law where they don't get caught. They can also manipulate the law where it becomes legal. It's their business, they can do what they want with it ultimately and noone can say boo to them. I'm not saying there is blatent throwing of games going on but it wouldn't surprise me if there are certain things going on that do shape the outcome in ways.
The thing is an official has already been caught betting on games and it does go on.. He was working indepentantly and different situation and level of total corruption but it does go on. He had inside knowledge on what goes on, that's the kicker. I don't think Donaghy was out there blatantly blowing calls and changing the outcome of games. He just knew how certain games were going to be called and knew the inner workings of games where he had an upper hand on betting. Yeah if he had to shave a point or two here or there no one would notice. Apparently someone did so the game isn't completely corrupt nor am I saying that. But there is corruption that goes on.
Re: For Conspiracy Theorists..... « Reply #11 on May 20, 2010, 3:40pm »
What I don't understand is why they don't do the actual lottery process live like they do the state lotteries where you actually see the balls come up into the cyclinder and reveals the numbers. Why do it behind close doors ?
It would be more exciting the pulling names out of envelopes.
What I don't understand is why they don't do the actual lottery process live like they do the state lotteries where you actually see the balls come up into the cyclinder and reveals the numbers. Why do it behind close doors ?
It would be more exciting the pulling names out of envelopes.
I kind of like the excitement of how it is now. They start with the worst pick (14 I think) and work their way down when a team gets skipped, like Washington and Philly, it adds to the excitement. Then it comes down to figuring out where in the top three that team will land.
What I don't understand is why they don't do the actual lottery process live like they do the state lotteries where you actually see the balls come up into the cyclinder and reveals the numbers. Why do it behind close doors ?
It would be more exciting the pulling names out of envelopes.
Because it would take too long. Havent you ever seen the lottery room before? its like thousands of numbers generated over and over. Each team assigned a few numbers based on their chance of winning and those numbers are rolled again and again god knows how many times to finally come up with the final result. Not as easy as just one set of balls coming up hehe
Re: For Conspiracy Theorists..... « Reply #14 on May 21, 2010, 3:22pm »
But when the Celtics were in the lottery, their numbers all included 3 basic numbers. If I remember correctly, they were all combinations of 1, 2 and 3. Now, if they want to fix the lottery so that the Celtics didn't win they would just paint one of those numbers with lead based paint and that number wouldn't come up. A PA Bingo hall got busted for doing the same thing a few years back. Not saying the NBA did it but, it would be very easy to do.
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